3 Nephi 21: 23-24:
Who are those referred to as "my people?" "My people" are "the remnant of Jacob."
Who are those referred to as "they?" The "they" are gentiles who have repented, come to Christ, entered into a covenant with Him, received the fullness of His Gospel, become heirs, and received the promise of land, and a connection with the promises to the remnant.
So it will be these few, chosen, covenantal gentiles who will "ASSIST" the remnant.
-They won't lead them,
They will "assist" them. What does "assist" mean? Who is taking the lead if the gentiles are only to "assist" in the process?
What will the remnant do? What city is to be built? Why is it called the New Jerusalem?
Forget everything you think you know about where the New Jerusalem is to be built. Most of the myth and traditions about it are based on incomplete and inaccurate recreations of the events.
Joseph sent the first missionaries to the Lamanites to find the place. The entire block of Native Americans east of the Mississippi, from the Delaware to the Cherokee, had been relocated at the time of the 1834 revelations regarding the New Jerusalem. At that brief moment in time, all of them were located just over the boundary of western Missouri. The closest you could get to them was Independence, Missouri. Since it was the remnant who would build the New Jerusalem, the obligation was to find them, preach to them, and assist them in building. But the missionaries couldn't do that. When they tried, they were sent out of the Indian Territory on the threat of being imprisoned. So Independence was as close as they could get.
The Native Americans have relocated and relocated again. Now they are nowhere near Independence. When Joseph fled Nauvoo in late June, days before his death, he was leaving for the Rocky Mountains where he intended to locate the remnant. He returned, was killed, and never made it out here.
Brigham Young tried to locate the remnant. In fact, the St. George Temple was built as the next fully functioning Temple at the chosen location precisely because it was intended to be near the remnant. In the very first endowment session, the Hopi Chief and his wife went through, received their endowment, and were sealed the next day. They were invited to try and connect with the remnant and this tribe was suspected as the one the Saints were to locate.
We've lost that fervor. We've assumed Independence is the site. We think we're going to build it. We have no clue we are only to "assist" and not control.
All of this is worth some study. But you're going to have to search back into history and ignore all the recent re-done and re-worked histories that ignore this early material. It's too much to get into in this post, but maybe I'll take it up at some point.
"And they shall assist my people, the remnant of Jacob, and also as many of the house of Israel as shall come, that they may build a city, which shall be called the New Jerusalem. And then shall they assist my people that they may be gathered in, who are scattered upon all the face of the land, in unto the New Jerusalem."
Who are those referred to as "my people?" "My people" are "the remnant of Jacob."
Who are those referred to as "they?" The "they" are gentiles who have repented, come to Christ, entered into a covenant with Him, received the fullness of His Gospel, become heirs, and received the promise of land, and a connection with the promises to the remnant.
So it will be these few, chosen, covenantal gentiles who will "ASSIST" the remnant.
-They won't lead them,
-preside over them,
-control them,
-subjugate them,
-nor dominate them.
They will "assist" them. What does "assist" mean? Who is taking the lead if the gentiles are only to "assist" in the process?
What will the remnant do? What city is to be built? Why is it called the New Jerusalem?
Forget everything you think you know about where the New Jerusalem is to be built. Most of the myth and traditions about it are based on incomplete and inaccurate recreations of the events.
Joseph sent the first missionaries to the Lamanites to find the place. The entire block of Native Americans east of the Mississippi, from the Delaware to the Cherokee, had been relocated at the time of the 1834 revelations regarding the New Jerusalem. At that brief moment in time, all of them were located just over the boundary of western Missouri. The closest you could get to them was Independence, Missouri. Since it was the remnant who would build the New Jerusalem, the obligation was to find them, preach to them, and assist them in building. But the missionaries couldn't do that. When they tried, they were sent out of the Indian Territory on the threat of being imprisoned. So Independence was as close as they could get.
The Native Americans have relocated and relocated again. Now they are nowhere near Independence. When Joseph fled Nauvoo in late June, days before his death, he was leaving for the Rocky Mountains where he intended to locate the remnant. He returned, was killed, and never made it out here.
Brigham Young tried to locate the remnant. In fact, the St. George Temple was built as the next fully functioning Temple at the chosen location precisely because it was intended to be near the remnant. In the very first endowment session, the Hopi Chief and his wife went through, received their endowment, and were sealed the next day. They were invited to try and connect with the remnant and this tribe was suspected as the one the Saints were to locate.
We've lost that fervor. We've assumed Independence is the site. We think we're going to build it. We have no clue we are only to "assist" and not control.
All of this is worth some study. But you're going to have to search back into history and ignore all the recent re-done and re-worked histories that ignore this early material. It's too much to get into in this post, but maybe I'll take it up at some point.
Denver,
ReplyDeleteDo you have a reference for this?
"he was leaving for the Rocky Mountains where he intended to locate the remnant."
I would be very interested in reading more about this... do you have more information you would be willing to direct me to? I've been curious about the remnant for the past year or so.
ReplyDeleteInteresting statement by Parley Pratt:
ReplyDeleteI was filled with joy and gladness, my spirit was made rich, and I was made to realize, almost as vividly as
if I had seen it myself, that the Lord Jesus Christ did appear in his own proper person, in his resurrected body,
and minister to the people in America in ancient times. He had surely risen from the dead and ascended into
heaven, and did come down on the American continent, in the land Bountiful, on the northern part of South
America, and did minister to the remnants of Joseph, called the Nephites, and did show his resurrected body
unto them.
JD 5:196, Parley P. Pratt, September 7, 1856
and this from Elder Pratt:
ReplyDeleteJD 9:180, Orson Pratt, July 15, 1855
Brethren and sisters, may God bless you, and may his Spirit inspire you when you lie down at night, and in
your dreams of the night, when you rise up in the morning, and when you go about your temporal labours.
May He inspire you continually to search and find out what your duties are to the remnants of Israel that are in
your midst. I ask that God will give you this spirit of inquiry and earnestness in the name of Jesus Christ.
Amen.
When Jesus comes to Zion as is here predicted, in the 59th chapter of Isaiah, he will come in the character of a
ReplyDeletegreat shepherd. Not in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory; but appearing in the midst of Zion
and administering to the remnants of Joseph in the character of a shepherd. From thence is the shepherd, the
stone of Israel. Now we all know that Jesus sprang from Judah; but here is a declaration that from Joseph is
the shepherd, the stone of Israel. That is, he will come the second time as a shepherd. He will gather his flock,
or as the Psalmist David has said, "Give ear, O Shepherd of Israel, thou that leadest Joseph like a flock, stir up
thy strength and come and save us." He will come as a shepherd, he will stir up his strength and show forth his
power and the remnant of Joseph will be lead by their shepherd, long before the Jews are redeemed. "Arise
and shine, for thy light is come, and the glory of the Lord is risen upon thee."
JD 14:355, Orson Pratt, March 10, 1872
Gerald N. Lund, Coming of the Lord:
ReplyDeleteI take it we, the members of the Church, most of us of the tribe of Ephraim, are of the remnant of Jacob. We know it to be the fact that the Lord called upon the descendants of Ephraim to commence his work in the earth in these last days. We know further that he has said that he set Ephraim, according to the promises of his birthright, at the head. Ephraim receives the "richer blessings," these blessings being those of presidency or direction. The keys are with Ephraim. It is Ephraim who is to be endowed with power to bless and give to the other tribes, including the Lamanites, their blessings. All the other tribes of Jacob, including the Lamanites, are to be crowned with glory in Zion by the hands of Ephraim.
Now do the scriptures teach that Ephraim, after doing all of this is to abdicate, or relinquish his place, and give it to the Lamanites and then receive orders from this branch of the "remnant of Jacob" in the building of the New Jerusalem? This certainly is inconsistent with the whole plan and with all that the Lord has revealed in the Doctrine and Covenants in relation to the establishment of Zion and the building of the New Jerusalem ....
That the remnants of Joseph, found among the descendants of Lehi, will have part in this great work is certainly consistent, and the great work of this restoration, the building of the temple and the City of Zion, or New Jerusalem, will fall to the lot of the descendants of Joseph, but it is Ephraim who will stand at the head and direct the work.
Gerald N. Lund, The Coming of the Lord , p.158
I think is the view that most of us have had in our heads since childhood. It could be why we assume when the President of the Church tells us, we will start the work of directing (Ephraim) and building (Manasseh) the New Jerusalem.
Doug
Anonymous:
ReplyDeleteRegarding Joseph leaving Nauvoo to go to the Rocky Mountains:
On June 22, 1844, Joseph was sent a threatening letter from Governor Ford in the which Joseph was accused of crimes he had not committed, and he could see he and his people would be at the mercy of the mobs who were organizing. Joseph wrote a reply to the governor stating he was planning to immediately travel to Washington DC and present the facts to the federal government where he was hopeful he could find some mercy. After completing this letter, Joseph was given a revelation which altered his plan to travel to the nation's capital. He told the brethren in his office: "It is clear to my mind what to do. All they want is Hyrum and myself; then tell everybody to go about their business, and not to collect in groups but to scatter about. There is no doubt they will come here and search for us. Let them search; they will not harm you in person or property, and not even a hair of your head. We will cross the river tonight, and go away to the west." At 2:00 am Joseph, Hyrum, Willard Richards, and Porter Rockwell, rowed across the Mississippi in a leaky boat, and arrived at daybreak on Sunday, June 23rd and went into hiding at William Jordan's house. He was sent a letter written by Emma (after others encouraged her to do so), pleading for him to return and calling him a coward for leaving the people. Joseph's reply was, "If my life is of no value to my friends, it is of none to myself." At this he and his companions returned to Nauvoo, and the rest is history--with the results being the martyrdom of he and Hyrum.
Please refer to History of the Church 6:545-550
As early as April 1834 Wilford Woodruff reports Joseph speaks of the Latter day Saints in the Rocky Mountains: ".......There will be tens of thousands of Latter-day Saints who will be gathered in the Rocky Mountains, and there they will open the door for the establishing of the gospel among the Lamanites, who will receive the gospel and their endowments and the blessings of God......the Latter-day Saints who dwell in these mountains will stand in the flesh until the coming of the Son of Man. The Son of Man will come to them while in the Rocky Mountains."
Wilford Woodruff, Conference Report, April 8, 1898, p. 57.
Anonymous:
ReplyDeleteRegarding Joseph leaving Nauvoo to go to the Rocky Mountains:
On June 22, 1844, Joseph was sent a threatening letter from Governor Ford in the which Joseph was accused of crimes he had not committed, and he could see he and his people would be at the mercy of the mobs who were organizing. Joseph wrote a reply to the governor stating he was planning to immediately travel to Washington DC and present the facts to the federal government where he was hopeful he could find some mercy. After completing this letter, Joseph was given a revelation which altered his plan to travel to the nation's capital. He told the brethren in his office: "It is clear to my mind what to do. All they want is Hyrum and myself; then tell everybody to go about their business, and not to collect in groups but to scatter about. There is no doubt they will come here and search for us. Let them search; they will not harm you in person or property, and not even a hair of your head. We will cross the river tonight, and go away to the west." At 2:00 am Joseph, Hyrum, Willard Richards, and Porter Rockwell, rowed across the Mississippi in a leaky boat, and arrived at daybreak on Sunday, June 23rd and went into hiding at William Jordan's house. He was sent a letter written by Emma (after others encouraged her to do so), pleading for him to return and calling him a coward for leaving the people. Joseph's reply was, "If my life is of no value to my friends, it is of none to myself." At this he and his companions returned to Nauvoo, and the rest is history--with the results being the martyrdom of he and Hyrum.
Please refer to History of the Church 6:545-550
As early as April 1834 Wilford Woodruff reports Joseph speaks of the Latter day Saints in the Rocky Mountains: ".......There will be tens of thousands of Latter-day Saints who will be gathered in the Rocky Mountains, and there they will open the door for the establishing of the gospel among the Lamanites, who will receive the gospel and their endowments and the blessings of God......the Latter-day Saints who dwell in these mountains will stand in the flesh until the coming of the Son of Man. The Son of Man will come to them while in the Rocky Mountains."
ReplyDeleteWilford Woodruff, Conference Report, April 8, 1898, p. 57.
Aren't the Lamanites as much of Ephraim as Manasseh, both being sons of Joseph and brothers? Ephraim received the birthright - Lehi was of the tribe of Manasseh while Ishmael was of Ephraim - All the descendants of these sons of Lehi would be a mix. These are the sons to whom this land was given - i.e. the remnant of Lehi and Ishmael - not the European Gentiles, even though by lineage most of us are of Ephraim - as Denver has pointed out, we are still a Gentile church and part of a Gentile nation who are here by the grace of God. I'm not sure Lund has drawn the correct conclusion? I think Denver has been pretty clear on this.
ReplyDeleteJR
This my own question: Joseph still stands at the head of this dispensation. Those building the New Jerusalem aren't necessarily dispensation heads - they have been given to build the city. Does is specifically say they hold the Keys of Zion? There are references indicating otherwise.
Gerald Lund's Work and the Glory series was a travesty. The movies worse. His acceptance of the call to the Seventy with a giddy implication about the fame of his books was disgusting to watch in a solemn assembly (it was a quick slip, I assume he repented). I am glad to see such behavior quips because I feel better about having mistakes, too. I still feel he is a decent man. I still love a lot of the charm he's pulled off towards Church history and did enjoy the Kingdom and the Crown series a good bit. With such a hunger for anything showing these episodes in history, I will take what I can get, but Lord please, send us better. Send us visions! We are so weak!
ReplyDeleteWe Gentiles are excelling at our movie making and documenting of our skills, history, and crafts. The irony is we are exposing our fears of falling as a people. We are desperately grasping at preserving what we know we are losing, but in effect offering up the intelligence that we know we are no longer worthy of, unwittingly giving the power of knowledge back to the very house of Israel who will use it to overrun us. Hollywood itself includes hours of behind the scene footage exposing the magic behind their talent thinking they are too powerful to ever fall to any rivals. Their prideful show of bravado exposes all of their weaknesses, yet they willingly give up control to tyrants being too tired from sin. It is the same for banking, medicine, sports, education and all other fields. We are exposed to thieves and robbers, because we are thieves and robbers ourselves.
ReplyDeleteIn the Millenium, children will likely read of our great fall in a book like the Book of Mormon, which will whisper from the dust of a once great, yet greatly fallen people. Perhaps the tragedy will ring so loudly and so long, no one will dare attempt our gross crimes for a 1,000 years.
While looking through an old worksheet and ran across the following on Ephraim:
ReplyDeleteDC27: 5 Behold, this is wisdom in me; wherefore, marvel not, for the hour cometh that I will drink of the fruit of the vine with you on the earth, and with Moroni, whom I have sent unto you to reveal the Book of Mormon, containing the fulness of my everlasting gospel, to whom I have committed the keys of the record of the stick of Ephraim;
Ezek. 37: 16.Moreover, thou son of man, take thee one a stick, and write upon it, For Judah, and for the children of Israel his companions: then take another stick, and write upon it, For Joseph, the stick of Ephraim, and for all the house of Israel his companions:
The Book of Mormon is "Ephraim" - therefore the people - the remnants must therefore be classed as "Ephraim" in the mind of the Lord. Am I reading this correctly?
I am realizing I need to find out what HE THINKS before I apply anything or conclude anything.
JR
Doug, JR and Zang Family,
ReplyDeleteRegarding the quote attributed to Gerald Lund...It is actually from Joseph Fielding Smith out of "Doctries of Salvation" p. 250 - 251.
My husband has not been reading this blog, but I tell him about it. Funny enough, about an hour ago, he came home for lunch and plopped a few photo copied pages out of "Doctrines of Salvation" as his "rebuttal" to all I have been relaying to him. He is troubled by D&C 133:30-34, as has been brought up, and can't see how repentant gentiles "assisting" the remnant fulfills the other revelations regardng Ephraim. Plus he now throws in the Joseph Fielding Smith quote and says this is an old debate and I'm now in the predicament of having to choose between the opinion of a prophet or Denver. (this is not contentious discussion, btw) I said I am confident Denver is very well aware of the Ephraim revelations and he(Denver) said it would take him time to lay it all out, so I am waiting to see the full explanation of the material, to see how "Ephraim" fits in, because to my knowledge, this hasn't been covered in full at this point. Just how does Ephraim being the leadership tribe fit in and HOW do repentent gentiles "assist"? What does that mean and, as some have suggested, is the remnant of Lehi also actually Ephraim and not just Manassah? Is that how both ideas tie together?
Lots of questions still, thrilled to be learning, but just wanted to clarify it was NOT a Gerald Lund original quote...but only used in his book from "Doctrines of Salvation."
Denver,
ReplyDeleteI'm baffled by your assertion that the New Jerusalem is not to be built in MO, centered in Independence. How on earth do you square this with D&C 57:1-3? At first I thought "Maybe I've incorrectly assumed that 'city of Zion' (v. 2) refers to the 'New Jerusalem'," but that seems clear from the 10th article of faith, Moses 7:62, and D&C 84:2. And speaking of D&C 84, verses 2-4 seem to further confirm the statement in D&C 57:1-3 that the city will be in MO, centered in Independence. Please explain.
Stay tuned. We'll get there.
ReplyDeleteAs I said when we began, you need to let the Book of Mormon speak for itself, and not impose upon it your own preconceptions.
We're just going to take the Book of Mormon text and keep looking at it. When we finish, we'll then look at the D&C, and Joseph's own conduct.
A different picture will surely emerge. You'll then have what you need to be able to make a choice.
D&C 57:3 does say "a spot" for the temple, not "the only spot" for the New Jerusalem temple...
ReplyDeleteSeems D&C 84:2-4 would have to be addressed with some seriously new concepts about prophecy, commanding, revoking, and the Lord's statement of things as they are and as they change based on our reactions to His pronouncements. Denver has a post a few back about the messages of prophets and their nature that someone else could link to from this thread if they wanted (I'm too lazy).
Let us not put up stakes for the Lord and the way He speaks with our narrow minded view of it at present. I am eager to get a better picture of the use of prophecy, for "a spot" surely leaves a window open for a change of venue....I would be sad to not have the Garden of Eden so honored, but do we know how big the Garden was anyway? Maybe a new spot has something way cooler to highlight, or maybe it isn't the crucial piece for the puzzle....exciting topics!