1 Nephi 13: 35:
"For, behold, saith the Lamb: I will manifest myself unto thy seed, that they shall write many things which I shall minister unto them, which shall be plain and precious; and after thy seed shall be destroyed, and dwindle in unbelief, and also the seed of thy brethren, behold, these things shall be hid up, to come forth unto the Gentiles, by the gift and power of the Lamb."
It is the Lamb who makes this promise. He declares He will "manifest" Himself to Nephi's seed. Christ promises the same thing (to "manifest" Himself) to the gentiles in our day. (1 Nephi 14: 1.) This original promise would be repeated by later Book of Mormon prophets.
The descendants of Nephi to whom the Lord would manifest Himself "shall write many things" which the Lord would minister. What does the qualification "many things" imply? Is "many" the same as "all things?"
The things to be written are what Christ "shall minister unto them." Is this limited to His ministry after His resurrection? Would it include all things which He "ministered" to them, even through prophetic ministers sent by Him?
Here again the words "plain and precious" are repeated. Why is this phrase used? What does it mean? Why was this what was removed by the "great and abominable church," but replaced through the things to be written by the Nephites? Is the fact Christ "ministered" to the Nephites, over a thousand-year dispensation, through many different ministers, in many different settings, alone evidence of something "plain and precious" to us? When Nephi would later write: "Wo be unto him that shall say: We have received the word of God, and we need no more of the word of God, for we have enough! For behold, thus saith the Lord God: I will give unto the children of men line upon line, precept upon precept, here a little and there a little; and blessed are those who hearken unto my precepts, and lend an ear unto my counsel, for they shall learn wisdom; for unto him that receiveth I will give more; and from them that shall say, We have enough, from them shall be taken away even that which they have. Cursed is he that putteth his trust in man, or maketh flesh his arm, or shall hearken unto the precepts of men, save their precepts shall be given by the power of the Holy Ghost Wo be unto the Gentiles, saith the Lord God of Hosts! For notwithstanding I shall lengthen out mine arm unto them from day to day, they will deny me; nevertheless, I will be merciful unto them, saith the Lord God, if they will repent and come unto me; for mine arm is lengthened out all the day long, saith the Lord God of Hosts. " (2 Nephi 28: 29-32.)
Is not speaking to the Lord, and more importantly hearing from Him the most plain, the most precious of things? Would the Lord have ever promised to come, take up His abode (John 14: 23), and sup with you (Rev. 3: 20-21) if He did not mean it? Does the Book of Mormon reiterate the promises given in the New Testament? Have they been restored to us by the Book of Mormon?
Here again we find the word "destroyed" used. "Destroyed" does not mean complete eradication. It means the loss of order, political independence and social coherence. Many will die, but they will not cease to exist.
What does "dwindle in unbelief" mean? Will anything be kept, although they should "dwindle?" Can a people "dwindle" and yet retain some truths?
It is not just the Nephite descendants who will "dwindle in unbelief," but "also the seed of thy brethren," the Lamanites. Whatever truths remain will not permit them to have on-going access to the Lord's presence. However, that does not mean they will not have Divine favor, does it? After all, the Lord gives to everyone precisely what will be best for them to know according to His wisdom. (Alma 29: 8.) Does dwindling mean that people are altogether lost to some portion of God's teachings and favor? How is it possible to determine if any people from any society are not being brought wisely along by the Lord?
The teachings that Christ will "minister" to the Nephites will be written, and then "these things shall be hid up, to come forth unto the Gentiles" at the appointed time. Why write them? Why preserve them? Why are the records of His acts important for others to learn about? Why would a record of His dealings need to eventually be brought to light? Will all His dealings eventually be brought to light? (2 Nephi 29: 13; D&C 133: 30.) If He, therefore, imparts His word to you, what becomes your responsibility?
What does the coming forth of the Nephite record "by the gift and power of the Lamb" mean? Will this same pattern repeat? (D&C 133: 26.) Will the "gift and power of the Lamb" be on display again? Will this "make bare His arm?" Will people finally consider things which they have previously ignored? (Isa. 52: 15.) Can you and I consider them now?
"For, behold, saith the Lamb: I will manifest myself unto thy seed, that they shall write many things which I shall minister unto them, which shall be plain and precious; and after thy seed shall be destroyed, and dwindle in unbelief, and also the seed of thy brethren, behold, these things shall be hid up, to come forth unto the Gentiles, by the gift and power of the Lamb."
It is the Lamb who makes this promise. He declares He will "manifest" Himself to Nephi's seed. Christ promises the same thing (to "manifest" Himself) to the gentiles in our day. (1 Nephi 14: 1.) This original promise would be repeated by later Book of Mormon prophets.
The descendants of Nephi to whom the Lord would manifest Himself "shall write many things" which the Lord would minister. What does the qualification "many things" imply? Is "many" the same as "all things?"
The things to be written are what Christ "shall minister unto them." Is this limited to His ministry after His resurrection? Would it include all things which He "ministered" to them, even through prophetic ministers sent by Him?
Here again the words "plain and precious" are repeated. Why is this phrase used? What does it mean? Why was this what was removed by the "great and abominable church," but replaced through the things to be written by the Nephites? Is the fact Christ "ministered" to the Nephites, over a thousand-year dispensation, through many different ministers, in many different settings, alone evidence of something "plain and precious" to us? When Nephi would later write: "Wo be unto him that shall say: We have received the word of God, and we need no more of the word of God, for we have enough! For behold, thus saith the Lord God: I will give unto the children of men line upon line, precept upon precept, here a little and there a little; and blessed are those who hearken unto my precepts, and lend an ear unto my counsel, for they shall learn wisdom; for unto him that receiveth I will give more; and from them that shall say, We have enough, from them shall be taken away even that which they have. Cursed is he that putteth his trust in man, or maketh flesh his arm, or shall hearken unto the precepts of men, save their precepts shall be given by the power of the Holy Ghost Wo be unto the Gentiles, saith the Lord God of Hosts! For notwithstanding I shall lengthen out mine arm unto them from day to day, they will deny me; nevertheless, I will be merciful unto them, saith the Lord God, if they will repent and come unto me; for mine arm is lengthened out all the day long, saith the Lord God of Hosts. " (2 Nephi 28: 29-32.)
Is not speaking to the Lord, and more importantly hearing from Him the most plain, the most precious of things? Would the Lord have ever promised to come, take up His abode (John 14: 23), and sup with you (Rev. 3: 20-21) if He did not mean it? Does the Book of Mormon reiterate the promises given in the New Testament? Have they been restored to us by the Book of Mormon?
Here again we find the word "destroyed" used. "Destroyed" does not mean complete eradication. It means the loss of order, political independence and social coherence. Many will die, but they will not cease to exist.
What does "dwindle in unbelief" mean? Will anything be kept, although they should "dwindle?" Can a people "dwindle" and yet retain some truths?
It is not just the Nephite descendants who will "dwindle in unbelief," but "also the seed of thy brethren," the Lamanites. Whatever truths remain will not permit them to have on-going access to the Lord's presence. However, that does not mean they will not have Divine favor, does it? After all, the Lord gives to everyone precisely what will be best for them to know according to His wisdom. (Alma 29: 8.) Does dwindling mean that people are altogether lost to some portion of God's teachings and favor? How is it possible to determine if any people from any society are not being brought wisely along by the Lord?
The teachings that Christ will "minister" to the Nephites will be written, and then "these things shall be hid up, to come forth unto the Gentiles" at the appointed time. Why write them? Why preserve them? Why are the records of His acts important for others to learn about? Why would a record of His dealings need to eventually be brought to light? Will all His dealings eventually be brought to light? (2 Nephi 29: 13; D&C 133: 30.) If He, therefore, imparts His word to you, what becomes your responsibility?
What does the coming forth of the Nephite record "by the gift and power of the Lamb" mean? Will this same pattern repeat? (D&C 133: 26.) Will the "gift and power of the Lamb" be on display again? Will this "make bare His arm?" Will people finally consider things which they have previously ignored? (Isa. 52: 15.) Can you and I consider them now?
1st Time Responder:
ReplyDeleteI have read many of the comments over the past couple of months when I began to follow the Blog regularly - The anxieties that Anonymous and Ben made pertaining to this morning's blog (Jun 30) on the criticisms in past blogs of the 'church' policies, etc and the calling Snuffer to repentance --I remembered my own similar reactions to his Second Comforter book when a friend tried to get me to read it. I rejected the offer first; He persisted and gave it to me and then I returned it. Finally I accepted the challenge and began to read. It was the title you see that frightened me - 'conversing with the Lord through the veil' - but I began to pray and ask - like many first-time investigators of the Book of Mormon - I did have a testimony of Moroni's promise - I could know the truth of ALL things - I ASK - and I knew that what he was saying was true - and more - it is POSSIBLE even for ME. I have since read all 6 of his books and MANY times I have had to apply the same formula - ASK to know how the LORD feels about what he is saying - ALWAYS I have been given an answer - and have had to tear away and discard a lot of the bands around my 'box' and throw them away - as more and more I have searched for myself to find the answer to what Snuffer wrote - and have yet to feel the need to call Snuffer to repentance - it is I who have changed my view point - sometimes after considerable study and searching on my own and even many anxious prayers. He does have a way of provoking these most serious of questions and sometimes he tears your insides to shreds in the process. I have learned that there is ALWAYS truth and MANY times I have initially felt him to be in error - but when I persist and set aside my own 'biased opinion' based on my LACK of understanding - if I go and plead with the Lord to understand Truth I am ALWAYS led to understand TRUTH. I have learned a lot!! Still lots of questions, but I KNOW that the Lord is the Way and that He always leads IF YOU ASK FOR TRUTH - Actually that is something I learned from the Second Comforter Book - that HE ALWAYS ANSWERS.
I won't say he doesn't frequently provoke the 'heck' out of me - but the search for truth, even to prove him wrong at times - has led me on some interesting journeys down some strange paths. I thank the Lord my God every day for some truth I learned, and frequently that truth is from the pen of Denver Snuffer.
AMEN to 1st time responder.
ReplyDeleteI am so Grateful to have truth spoken so plainly (especially from a lawyer).
Thank you for sharing your experience with us.
May we all seek to find answers to our questions from the ONE TRUE SOURCE.. It is of my opinion that Denver is giving us some help with the kind of questions to ask Him.
As much as I would like to have Denver answer many (if not all of the questions he posted on this blog).. he would be doing us a diservice if he did. Each one of us needs to recieve the answers ourselves.
Nicely said David.... always good to hear from you.
ReplyDelete:)
Donald
Provo
I guess I'll chime in here. I'm in the camp with 1st Time Responder and David. I won't repeat their sentiments here, but I will add that I hope the call for Denver to "repent" won't change his teaching style and observations. It's true that he is bold and some of his viewpoints can be uncomfortable, if not painful. Folks, we're peeling off the natural man, one layer of skin at a time. It's going to smart. The bands of hell have some of us in an exceedingly tight grip, and great is the soreness thereof even as we loosen them. Could it be that this is how we remove our stumbling blocks? Is this how Satan is cast out of our presence?
ReplyDeleteI might add that this is Denver's blog, although he allows some (often very insightful) comments from the peanut gallery. I, too, wish sometimes that there weren't so many question marks in his posts. Those cause more pain to me than the bold comments, just because it means I have to go wrestle with the Lord for the answer. But I am grateful for that process (fine, I'll admit it).
---Doug
This isn't really on topic, but perhaps you may want to respond at some point. 1 Nephi 11:1 says that Nephi was caught up "into an exceedingly high mountain," where he was "shown all things."
ReplyDelete(1 Nephi 14:26) Moses also was "caught up into an exceedingly high mountain," and he too saw the world and its' inhabitants in their entirety.
At this time, Moses was told by the Lord that "I have a work for thee." This is the very same language that Joseph Smith was given when the Angel Moroni told Joseph that "God had a work for (him) to do."
The pattern which seems to emerge is that the vision of all things is a gift given to those that progress to a certain point. And, that associated with this vision is a tailored "work" which God gives to each of his children who part the veil.
Does this pattern apply to all who succeed in parting the veil? Can we hope for a work specifically designed for each individual?
Thank you very much for your efforts with this blog.
Great question Gordon. Nephi has a partial answer to your question which is "off topic". He says:
ReplyDelete"Behold, this is the doctrine of Christ, and there will be no more doctrine given until after he shall manifest himself unto you in the flesh. And when he shall manifest himself unto you in the flesh, the things which he shall say unto you shall ye observe to do." 2 Nephi 32:6
This statement by Nephi may have many correct interpretations, but the one brought to my mind is:
After you come unto Christ (Second Comforter) He gives you a new work to do, a new set of commandments.
I'd love to hear other blogsters comments on this and love to read Denver's as well, ideally on a 2 Nephi 30-33 verse by verse blog segment.